Jovial (3 March 2014)
"What is meant by "MANY WATERS" and what Nation(s) sit on "many waters""


It has been proposed that the USA is "Babylon", and one alleged "proof" is that it is the only nation that sits on many oceans.  I find this to be faulty logic.

There is only one ocean.  We give that ocean different names in different places; the Pacific, the Atlantic, etc., but there is really only one ocean because all "oceans" connect at some point.  I think the phrase "many waters" refers to independent streams; mutiple rivers coming together.  And the identification of the WHORE is a CITY (not a nation) that sits on many rivers, flowing from indepedent sources.

Keep in mind that

  • If we allow each independently named part of the Ocean to be considered a separate "water", then ALL CONTINENTS SIT ON "MANY WATERS" and THE USA SITS ON FEWER "WATERS" THAN MOST!!!

Europe borders the Atlantic Ocean, Artic Ocean, and Mediteranean Sea.  Canada borders the Artic, Pacific and Atlantic.  Both are one "water" more than the USA. Africa borders the Atlantic Ocean, Mediteranean Sea and Indian Ocean; again. more waters than the USA.  Russia borders the Artic Ocean and Atlantic and Asia as a Continent borders that plus the Indian and Mediteranean.

One proof that the phrase "many waters" is not a reference to the Ocean is that we're told in Numbers 24:7 that Israel sits on "many waters" in the Bible, but it borders no body of water we call in our times an "Ocean". Another proof is that we are told the city of Babylon sits on "many waters".  We're told this in Jer 51;

יב אֶל-חוֹמֹת בָּבֶל שְׂאוּ-נֵס, הַחֲזִיקוּ הַמִּשְׁמָר--הָקִימוּ שֹׁמְרִים, הָכִינוּ הָאֹרְבִים: כִּי, גַּם-זָמַם יְהוָה--גַּם-עָשָׂה, אֵת אֲשֶׁר-דִּבֶּר אֶל-יֹשְׁבֵי בָבֶל. 12 Set up a standard against the walls of Babylon, make the watch strong, set the watchmen, prepare the ambushes; for the LORD hath both devised and done that which He spoke concerning the inhabitants of Babylon.
יג שכנתי (שֹׁכַנְתְּ) עַל-מַיִם רַבִּים, רַבַּת אוֹצָרֹת; בָּא קִצֵּךְ, אַמַּת בִּצְעֵךְ. 13 O thou that dwellest upon many waters, abundant in treasures, thine end is come, the measure of thy covetousness.

So here, Babylon is described as dwelling "upon many (רַבִּים) waters", and then it is followed by "abundant (רַבַּת) in treasures."  The same Hebrew root is used for both "many" as for "abundant", as this is intentional, because those "many waters" provide easy trade routes from many nations to get to Babylon, and this enabled the increase of wealth.  Ancient Mesopotamia was located between the Tigris and the Euphrates Rivers, and Babylon was the Gateway between that rich area and Babylonia.  Several other cities in its region could also be considered to sit on "many waters"

As can be seen by the diagram, another smaller river merged with the Euphrates where Babylon was founded.  There are also other cities in the region that sit near "many waters", including Ninevah, Nippur, and Ur.

The shows that the Euphrates itself is a merged river of 3 other rivers from 3 sources.

In Revelation 17, we again see the phrase "many waters" used, and we're told the WHORE sits on it, and the WHORE is identified as a CITY as well, not a larger nation, and we're told it is "Babylon", which does indeed sit on many waters, something that can be verified by Jer 51, as well as by the map above.

The USA does not sit "on" many waters, but CONTAINS many waters.  It is a nation.  Nearly ever nation its size contains "many waters".  Most nations a fraction of its size contain "many waters".  Minnesota alone is known as the "Land of 1,000 lakes."  But not every city sits on multiple rivers.  Some cities have no water nearby at all.  What Revelation 17 is identifying is a city (not a nation) that , like Babylon, sits near a variety of rivers.

 

Shalom,

Joe