...did not believe in the resurrection.  but in fact the resurrection and the life walked among them.  sometimes our beliefs don't line up with the facts.  the only truth I know is Jesus Christ and He says a tree is known by it's fruit.  good tree, good fruit...bad tree, bad fruit.

 

John 10:10 tells us the THIEF comes only to steal, kill, and destroy.  Christ says he came so we could have life to the full.

 

how is it that love, prayer, praise and healing (both physical and spiritual) good fruit-- have anything to do with stealing, killing, or destroying? bad fruit

 

ephesians 4:13 makes it clear that we are to grow till we ALL reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge(hopefully this hasn't passed away) of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the WHOLE MEASURE OF THE FULLNESS OF CHRIST. now that's a tall order without some Holy Spirit indwelling and quite a bit of supernatural activity too since the Christ went about healing the sick and preaching the gospel of the Kingdom.

 

we are marked with the seal you mentioned ephesians 1:13 go on and read 19 and 20.  what is that nature of that Power called our inheritance and His Mighty Strength (I added the caps obviously).  the same power that raised the Christ from the dead dwells in you as a believer.

 

now, look at the tense of the sentence in ch 2 verse 6 God actually sees us as raised up with Christ and seated with Him in Him. why, because He loves us so much and He wanted to. WOW!!!  sorry I got a little excited.  you know it would take a lot of time and space to list all the red lettered passages where my Lord tells me that my faith and belief and prayer can result in the miraculous...and I really have no use for arguing folks.  a man with an experience is never at the mercy of a person with an argument besides, I love all of you anyway and just want to share the love of Christ.

 

this is how I see it.  it has nothing to do with your salvation.  I'm sure you are ALL saved Holy Spirit filled folks.  don't you owe it to yourselves to check it out at least.  I'm reminded of mark 6 where Jesus goes to nazareth and the scriptures say He could not do any miracles there except lay hands on a few people and heal them because the people in the town had so much unbelief.  so if you are scared, remember that God hasn't given you a Spirit of fear, but of power and love and a sound mind.  don't forget that paul tells timothy that in the last days some folks will operate in the form of Godliness but in denial of the power...I wonder what power they will deny?  seriously, a powerless church? or a powerless gospel? who would fall for that one?  well the church that I grew up in did for some reason.  I only discovered the truth from the scripture and from seeing the mighty transformation of lives and yes, actual healings many.  and yes God has actually healed people through the power of His Holy Spirit using lil ole me.

 

for those of you who think Jesus only gave the mark 16 command only to the disciples, 11 plus matthias and later paul, how is it that the red letters tell us that “these signs will accompany those who believe”---so at least the spiritual offspring of the disciples right?  where again does it say that the gifts stop?  ahhh, the famous 1 cor 13 passage I was actually taught to read it like you do now.  first, have you even considered that we are instructed in ch 14 to follow the way of love(this is good right) and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially prophecy.  hmm, I don't think my Daddy will give me a scorpion, or a snake or a stone to play with do you? certainly not.  you have nothing to be afraid of when it comes to Holy Spirit.  He loves you.  if you read 14 you will find that there is singing in tongues, speaking in tongues(privately to God) and speaking in tongues to a group in worship time (requires interpretation).  when tongues are spoken in acts speak about the wonderful works of God'.  I'm only mentioning tongues because this is usually the gift that freaks so many people out that they look to establish the ceasing of them.  ok, back to ch 13 we only differ in what we think that which is perfect' is.  seriously.  where do we get that this is the completion of scripture?  you know, even if we take tongues out of the equation, lets look at what we're saying has ceased prophecy? what about all the Isaiah and ezekiel prophecies we all are looking at being fullfilled before our very eyes?  I'm certainly not suggesting that we write more prophetic books of scripture because we still have people operating in gifts of prophecy yes again I've seen it and been part of it.  I'm merely talking about the kind that benefits the church/the kingdom of Christ.  again, you don't have to believe in these things to be partakers of Christ.  but we were told to eagerly desire them, so if this is wrong, what other parts of the scripture can we brush off?  ok, how about knowledge what kind of knowledge are we saying has ceased?...so...if tongues have ceased then these also? well, again I won't bother to respond again to such things if people want only to argue and scare folks or to demean anyone...I love you guys.  well, I have to ask two more things and then I'll close.

 

why did james the brother of Jesus tell me in his letter to pray over the sick and to anoint with oil in the name of the Lord.  with the prayer of faith not do what james said it would or was this only for the twelve scattered tribes of believers?  if the prayer and healing were only for them, what other instructions for living are we free to ignore? taming our tongues? humbling ourselves?

 

the second item is Jesus vision.  I can see that he prayed for you and i in the garden in John 17:20-25.  hebrews 12 tells me that the joy set before him (had to be you and i) endured the cross...ephesians (and several other places) tell us we're adopted in and have an inheritance in Christ.  other passages tell us we're seated with Christ now and that we are somehow crucified with Christ and no longer live (gal 2:20), that we are new creations, and that there are good works that God has prepared for us in advance that we might walk in them.  with such a vision for the future, how can we say that God has removed from us the power he promised?  romans 11:29 says God's gifts and his call are irrevocable.

 

ok, I'll pipe down.  you can bash me if you like or refute me, but I'll not be upset or get feisty with you all again, because I love you.  in closing, I look at it this way:  let's say you all are right about this and I'm deceived by a false doctrine, when in reality the gifts ended long ago.  well the first implication of this would mean that there would be a lot of new testament that I could skim over that wouldn't apply to me in this dispensation and if God still doesn't do mighty works (supernatural) today, then I'm left with evangelizing by reasoning with folks, which will still win a few(acts 17:34)...and also, maybe some might ask me why I'm living differently then them and they might believe (I peter 3:15).  then after dying, or being raptured I meet the Lord face to face.  I imagine He would smile and put his arm around me and say something like, jb, I love you, you simple guy you...you should have been able to figure out that the gifts stopped long before you were born and I was working in a new way, but I'm pleased that you had the faith to believe what I said to my disciples even though those promises were for another time not for you.  the healings you thought you thought we did together were just coincidences.  and when people praised my name, gave me glory and allowed Holy Spirit to transform them after they were healed and delivered, well they were going to do that anyway.  don't feel too bad though my son, for you have a little fruit from reasoning with folks and telling them about me.' I guess I don't think He will hold it against me (no sin will be held against me anyway, YAY, God!!!) that I thought His power was great enough to do the things like in Acts even thousands of years after he walked the earth.

 

I can't imagine how I would feel if I spent my time trying to convince His sheep that His gospel was changed to a powerless gospel.  see His Holy Spirit is transforming me even now into His very image love...cause that's what it's all about...the amazing Love of God for the people He created and died for...see the passage you use to discredit the gifts says that 3 remain, faith, hope and love...not fear, doubt and unbelief...I'll be none of you that wrote even made time to listen to dan mohler from my first post.  I love you guys. just ask Holy Spirit about these things and I guarantee you He will show you.

God bless you all.

jb sikes