Ted Porter (11 Sep 2006)
"Re: James Rea (9 Sep 2006),"Re: Jim Bramlett 'This takes the cake'""


There are many fellow believers in a post-trib rapture:

For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.  For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.  For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:  Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.  I Thessalonians 4:14-17

I Thessalonians 4:14 and 16 are the only two verses in the Bible that contain the two words "alive" and "remain".  If we say that verse 15 is referring to His second coming, when he cleaves the Mount of Olives in Jerusalem, not the rapture, then we are forced into saying that verse 17 is referring to a rapture that happens at the same time as His second coming.

And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.  Zechariah 14:4

I personally think it is more a logistics problem in our own human understanding as to why would we all meet him in the air when He is half way down to Earth.  We would then, being with Him evermore, follow Him back down to Earth where He would enter the East Gate and set up His millennial kingdom, with all of us following Him.  That is why when the text states, "the coming of the Lord", we assume this is the "next" coming of the Lord, and the Lord would be returning after gathering us from the far corners of Heaven, in His "last" or actually "third" coming as King of Kings.

But either way we should watch for His coming again in obedience to Scripture, either to hopefully meet Him in the air, as He then proceeds back up into Heaven, or as He then proceeds down to the Mount of Olives.

Talking about dates.  Dating His birth and adding 33 years can yield dates ranging from 6 BC to 6 AD.

And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus that all the world should be taxed.  (And this taxing was first made when Cyrenius was governor of Syria.)  Luke 2:1-2

We actually have good records of a taxing in 6 AD when Cyrenius was governor of Syria, but it has been reported that other records have come to light that Cyrenius was also governor during earlier taxings, but the records are not at all as good.

Also, using 6 BC would yield 28 AD, (33-5 as there was no 0 year).

However, Roman records lets us date the start of His ministry more accurately:

Now in the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberius Caesar, Pontius Pilate being governor of Judaea, and Herod being tetrarch of Galilee, and his brother Philip tetrarch of Ituraea and of the region of Trachonitis, and Lysanias the tetrarch of Abilene, Annas and Caiaphas being the high priests, the word of God came unto John the son of Zacharias in the wilderness.  Luke 3:1-2

We know that Tiberius Caesar started his reign in 14 AD.  There are some that would argue that he was coregent for two years before 14 AD.  Although it seems like more people would state that at the time Luke was written, the people accepted 14 AD as Tiberius Caesar's official start of his reign.

So, if we take the earliest date possible we have 12 AD + 14 years = 26 AD as when John the Baptist started.  Let us add half a year for when Jesus started his ministry, also taken as being at the age of 30.  So 26.5 AD plus the normally assumed 3.5 year ministry yields 30 AD.  To get to 27 AD death we would have to have only a half a year ministry for Christ.  (I'm using the start of the year being around April as it was in the past.)

Just thought I'd comment on this.

Shalom,
Ted Porter