Barry Amundsen (21
"Thank you Harvey Troyer for clearing up about David Flynn et al"
Thank you so much for taking the time to clear that up!
too have had my encounters over the years with the sort of folks
(preparedness movement) that you describe who insist that we will not
be raptured prior to at least some if not all of the tribulation
period. I too have debated some of them and in some cases was able to
share the very points that you have also used to show the error. I have
been regretful of the OSAS belief as well for many of the same hurts
and confusions that it has certainly caused and can see how it has
contributed to this error also.
Although I have listened
closely to David Flynn with a hope to glean from him his rapture view
and the why for it, I had not heard as complete an explanation as you
have given and this now makes a lot of sense. I feel great sorrow for
those of that persuasion because I fear that God will give them their
way if they want to stay behind. Many of them (such as those at the
Prophecy Club - he became so anti pre trib that he stopped letting pre
trib people speak at his ministry) teach that God will miraculously
protect them through it. Another teacher that I spoke to on the phone
believes that he will be saved by surviving the tribulation in his
mortal body. Well, I don't like their chances...
there is the equally wrong belief on the other side of the coin that
all the church will go whether one believes in it and is looking for
Jesus or not as though such topics are trivial. I once heard Chuck
Missler quip during a talk about the rapture that he believes that all
will be included and those who do not believe in a pre trib rapture are
not to worry the rest of us will explain it to them on the way up...
and the audience laughed. But I disagree. To them who LOOK for Him will
He appear. Jesus is against 5 7ths of the church over doctrinal errors
and practices. Wrong beliefs will be disastrous for many. Remember the
so-called "pan-tribulationists"? They also liked to make light of it
saying "Well, I believe it'll all pan out in the end..." And they don't
care to look into anything in depth on the subject. SCARY! It is not
going to pan out well for them when they find that their lamps are
going out and they are unable to go out and meet the Bridegroom.
agree with what you say that first of all the debate over the proper
interpretation of 2 Thes (which has blazed hot here on the Doves over
the years) is a huge point and will decide much of what else a person
believes on the rapture. It seems God allowed this kind of choice so
that those who will rely on the Holy Spirit will see it but others will
use their own understanding and come to an opposite conclusion. Also
the point about Antichrist overcoming the saints is as you said; not we
who look for Christ but those who stayed behind. (I recently posted
about that on the Doves.)
Bottom line is that I am very
grateful for you clearing this up for me about Flynn because I
suspected but was not fully aware that he was in that camp (no pun
intended cuz they store supplies and hope to camp in caves or something
to survive the trib.) Now I can lean more confidently on a sooner
escape than having to bow to his 2012 idea.
Thank you so much!