Barry Amundsen (28 Jan 2012)
"Re: Paul Wilson and John B "Few, a relative term""

 
Enoch describes the return from heaven with Jesus as the Lord coming with "ten thousands" of his saints.
 
Jude 1: 
14.  And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
 15.  To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.
 
Whatever way you look at that it doesn't really conjure a huge number to me at least (such as the multitude that no man could number that come out of the great tribulation). Enoch or at least certainly the Holy Spirit knows the difference between ten thousands and say two hundred million (two hundred thousand thousand) as in the case of the great army in Revelation which suggests that this number ten thousands was chosen with purpose.
 
How big a number does that phrase (ten thousands) suggest and where would the cutoff be in numbers before you could no longer use that phrase to accurately describe it that way? Once you get passed multiples of ten thousands and then hundreds of thousands and then move into the millions there should be a newer more definitive way to describe that larger group as say hundreds of thousands etc if you are in fact dealing with that many. To leave it at ten thousands sounds like a rather small number compared to the way we usually hear suggestions of millions of people being raptured etc.
 
Are Enoch and Jude suggesting by this description that the numbers coming back with Jesus are relatively small. I've always assumed that we all would be coming back with Jesus at this point could it be that not every saved or raptured person will be called to fight in this battle? If so then this number would not be an issue but I thought of this number when I saw Paul Wilson and John B's posts about how many might be raptured. What about the the verse of Revelation 5:11 and how this is described?
 
 
Revelation 5:
11. And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;
 
It may not be intended to give any idea as to actual numbers at all but just mean a lot. I believe as many as want to come in there is room for but there is the warning that many will seek to enter and will not be able, why is that?
 
Luke 13:
 23.  Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them,
 24.  Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.
 25.  When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:
 26.  Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.
 27.  But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.
 28.  There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
 29.  And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God.
 30.  And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.
 
I definitely want to be in that number that gets in!